Ain't that the truth. I'll post some comparison pics.

I like many others are glued to this to see just what happens when they go on the car. I think that if they turn out decent I might be in for a set just not this season funds are low and I have a head I still need to get

Bam!

Brad, These things are awesome!

We need to collaborate on some 1g design work!

Man guys, calm down until we make sure they fit and work and such. And Mike, let me get my car on the road, then I can take on a new project! They do look sick though.

Looks like you did a good job with masking, that will make my life much easier! Guess I know what I'll be doing this coming week.

P.S. Mike, I love your sig.

What did one mechanical engineer say to the other?

Lets design a tool to make a square hole instead of designing the hole round








OEM VS Brad

Looks really good guys!!

I do have a question though, the first hole on the left side of the new one is so much smaller than the oem hole, why is that?

Whenever Brad, when it comes to my talon there is no due dates. Now lets see some install pictures.

Because spherical bearings don't need big holes like rubber bushings.

I thought Rob would reply with something like "who doesn't like a small hole?"

They are out of my hands, Its now on Brad to update us with his progress.

I promised him Id be at the first race he attends with these arms. Should be interesting to say the least.

Got one side worth of king pins done tonight. Received bearings today so I was able to machine to suit the shafts. Test fit the bearing block on the car with pins and it all seems like it fits nicely.

Bushings and boring out the arms to fit the bearings hopefully tomorrow (pending wife approval!) then I can fit up one side complete.

I'm a pretty poor machinist and I'm doing it all manually so it will take a couple of days to burn through this stuff. Takes extra time for design changes when I screw up on the lathe:)

Cheers.

I have one side mostly done, other than a bushing and it all seems to fit up fine. Only problem is I have a tripple header end of may and am spending almost a week at the cottage between now and then so, though I'll have enough time to finish everything by then, I won't have time to set it up and tune it before I drive 5 hours away from my shop for 3 straight days of racing. I'd rather do initial testing/tuning close to home.

So... I've decided to throw OEM arms on it this week so I can get my car running properly in the short term then I can finish the rest of the bits for the other side without rushing.

Anyone have a front lower control arm I can borrow for a couple of weeks? I destroyed one of mine for testing.

Just wanted to say good work!!!! I will be grabbing the full setup off u in the near future!!

How bout an update slacker? How was your race weekend a few weeks back?

Race was this weekend. I'll post in race report. SHould be bolting it up this week. Sorta glad I have this already worked out since I nuked my stock arms at shannonville. Sort of scary to drive right now.

OK, sorry for the delay but I have fully installed the driver side set. Did a quick alignment and took it for a test drive. Feels really solid. Won't be able to tell for sure until I get the other side installed and take it to an autox but first impression is that life is good.

Right now I should have around 3.5 degrees of camber on that side (2 from the new arms, 1.5 from ingalls offset upper a-arm mounts). That will probably be a little much for the street (I'm thinking I'll aim for 2.5) but man does it turn in right now, plus it looks bad a$$. Also the new arms make the front sit about 1 1/2" lower (with stock suspension and full suspension travel) which also helps.

Everything fit up fine, had to shorten the 2 kingpins (removed extra material not used by some bottom nuts) to give what I consider adequate clearance to the rim. Also had trouble with getting the right bolts (Socket heads, which are 12.9, don't clear the axle boot so had to find hex heads, which are hard to get in decent strengths) Tested lock to lock and some good quick turns. No binding or weird noises.

I have renewed enthusiasm. Have some small changes to make from what I learned for the passenger side. Hopefully by this weekend...if my wheels don't fall off before that;)

Bradley, there's some guys on Tuners that might be interested in this, Paul Volk (99GSTRacer), Greengoblin, etc.

Post in the Custom Fab forum.

I can't wait to see the results of this.

OK, had first autoX on the new arms today. Crazy hot but I was competitive with top 10 all day. Ended up 14th out of 90 odd competitors, but duffed my last run so I was right in it. In terms of suspension here is what I have to report:

-Wheels stayed on so that is good.
-I need a little more cleanance since my R-compounds are on rims with just slightly small internal diameter. I had one of my king pin nuts rub the inside of the wheel when I was full locked going sideways. Easy fix.
-Turn in is rediculous, I made a lot of corners I never would have thought I could just simply due to that improvement. Knock on effect was that transitions (i.e. slalom) speeds were also better.
-I'm on stock suspension and the arms lower the front end. Until I get coil overs I can't lower the rear which is not great for balance. It also means I am into parts of the suspension performance curves that I didn't really design around due to lack of spring stiffness.
-The new arms significantly increase the effective front roll stiffness, while the rear has stayed the same. I don't have adjustable dampers so I can only use tire pressure to rebalance it. I noticed that I could turn in fast, carry more speed, but ultimately push at the apex. No where near as bad as stock but I spent a lot of effort getting it neutral originally. I'd like to move more stiffness back to the rear with spring rate. I think I also may have dialed in too much caster (is there such a thing?) which gives me too much camber (wtf?) mid corner.
-On the highway it is a little less planted. I chalk this up to the reduced scrub radius. I think I'll make some adjustments to bring some back and take a little bit of caster out at the same time. SHould help to rebalance things with minimal compromise.
-On the whole net benefit but with some tuning (and if necessary remaking the knuckle mount...ROb!)I think I can get much more benefit, so needs more cooking before I release the design for mass consumption. One of the great things is I can actually make adjustments now to achieve my goals..Yay!

Send me the models, I'll make them ASAP. New job Monday. Boss encourages me to use machinery. Brand new five axis in an air conditioned shop.

Let's rock. Fix that design ASAP. I want my arms sooner than later. Thanks mr lab rat

Also If I give u cad for an evo 8 enkei, can u plug that into your suspension software and check for clearance issues?

sure can.

Thumbs up is all I can say

Just a quicky update. Last 2 races have been raining, so can't really gauge where I am. I've been fiddling with camber and toe and now I'm going to start dialing in castor. I still haven't put in the revII revised geometry as I want to get a really good understanding of where I am before round 2 starts. I wish I had an alignment machine in my garage.

My set-up was wicked in the wet though! Had a couple of full on 4 wheel drifts through gates and was top three until it started to dry up a little and then people with better tires just destroyed me:( My times in the rain were faster than my times in the semi-wet/dry...go figure.

Oh, and nothing has busted yet!

Bradley, I think I want some! When developement is complete
In no hurry, and spending too much elsewhere currently

Another update. Had another race on saturday. I made some adjustments (added castor primarily...can YOU do that;)) and BAM. By a wide margin the best the car has ever handled. I'm pretty sure it is the best handling DSM on OEM shocks and springs! Major improvements in mid corner and exit grip. I found myself having to tell myself to push it harder. I actually hugged my car after my second run, we had a moment, it was great.

The castor also helped with high speed stability that I was chasing.

I'm going to see if I can any more castor out of it for kicks and then call it a day...and work on getting a true north racing style coil over set-up to take it to the next level. Oh, and my second child is scheduled to be born in the next couple of weeks. Basically I'd like one or two more autoX and a track day before I declare total victory but things are looking very promising.

When can we buy some !! ?

So here is the problem Mike. At the moment there are a lot of pieces and it would be really expensive. Even if I got 100 sets made in china it would still cost me around $700 or more a set so they would have to sell for more than that to cover the risk involved. To give you an idea, the aluminum for the arms cost $300 and the spherical bearings cost $250. Realistically if someone like Ziggy were to sell them he'd have to charge like $1200 and still not make much margin. DSMer's are way to cheap for that.

Basically part of the design uses a yoke to relocate the suspension pivots on the upright inorder to move the imaginary pivot around and do some fancy fancy. I also designed it this way for peace of mind, yokes are much stronger than cantilevered ball joints, that is why race cars typically yoke their heim joints (but OEM uses cantilevered ball joints so I'm just being conservative) This creates a lot of parts and cost. I think I may have a way to get rid of some of the complexity but I'm not sure how much it will compromise the performance. It would still maintain castor adjustability and lower the car without screwing up your geometry while lengthening the lower arms, maintaining spring travel, and improveing the camber curve and that is 90% of the benefit. The other 10% is much more complicated and requires the pivot relocation. It is possible that the 10% is actually only 1 or 2% and it makes very little difference except in my head.


If I can get to it before baby arrives i will try to test some of this out. Makes me sad thinking about taking it apart since it took me so long to get it near perfect!

Oh and roundabouts are so much more fun now!

Bradley, keep in mind that I have manufacturing capability as well. I currently don't do 3d machining, but I am sure Rob C. would help with 3d programming and setting up my machine for "drip feed" if it were to come to pass, or could the part be simplified a little to machine with standard 2 1/2 axis programming? I might not be quite as cheap as China, but don't require the runs be as huge, and saves a lot of shipping cost. I MIGHT also be able to do better on material cost. We have enough on our plate at the moment, but food for thought...

no rush but I d have no problem paying what its worth in the future. doesnt have to be anytime soon. But Im starting the process of turning my car into a race car (road legal race car)I wana own porsches hahah

Any pics of these on a car yet? Update!!!!

Any updates on these?
I don't need them just yet but it would be nice to know if they were available.

I'm just getting ready to drop in a set of FNR style Koni & GC springs and drop the car. Hopefully be complete this week. I'll take some more pics while I am in there. I'm also adding some more castor while I am at it.

After a close inspection after a year of autocross everything seems to be holding up great. I've made a couple of tweaks along the way to get more wheel clearance and make it easier to assemble/disassemble. At the beginning of the season everything fit fine, but as I dialed it all in cornering forces went up and I got some rubbing. The extra camber and caster (plus some improvement in driving skill) resulted in me taking off about 1-1.5 seconds over the year before and being a lot better to drive.

I think my long term plan is to keep the same concept but redesign around tubular/welded steel components. The aluminum is just way too expensive. I also have a track day beginning of june where I can test to make sure everything holds together and make sure everything is good at higher speeds stability wise.

Is Brad still alive or did these arms kill him ? Bringing this thread back from the dead!! People still would love these including me...