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Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113764
January 22, 2005 01:37 am UTC
January 22, 2005 01:37 am UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Hey there all,

Well I've read all the horror stories of what's happened to me. I can't believe ONE lousy nut can cause such a headache!

The nut that holds the oil pump pulley on let go on me a few months back, which in turn caused many belts to slip and let go, one of which was the all important timing belt. This in turn caused the engine to stop.

Today I have finally gotten the head off, and what did I find? No surprise, bent valves and in fact rockers rolling around inside with the cams. However one thing I did find which troubles me is that the tops of the pistons are now dented from hitting the valves.

I have a block with pistons and a head from that same block as well, so my question is do I replace the pistons, or rebuild the engine with the head that contains non-damaged valves and see what happens?

I can only afford Fridays to work on this with my schedule, so it's taken me a long time to get to this point. Any ideas on how much extra work's involved at the point I'm at now to remove the pistons and install the other block's pistons? I presume I'll need new rings as well right, anything else? I've already got a FelPro gasket set ready to go in.

You can go here to see images of what I\'m talking about. (Click Me)

Thanks in advance,

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113765
January 22, 2005 01:45 am UTC
January 22, 2005 01:45 am UTC

A
Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Dude, those grooves you are referring to are always there. Youd see metal if it was piston pieces. Looks like you just need a rebuilt head.

Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113766
January 22, 2005 02:21 am UTC
January 22, 2005 02:21 am UTC
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,369
Regina, Sk
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Chris Clark Offline
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1990 TSi AWD - Parked since I bought it (Jan24/03)
Had it out one day, and busted the trans.
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113767
January 22, 2005 02:52 am UTC
January 22, 2005 02:52 am UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
HOLY CRAP! No kidding, that is SUCH great news! I just ran outside and looked at the tops of the pistons of the other block I have, and low and behold those half moons are there!

Wicked, now I just have to reassemble!

Is there a way to clean up the pistons without removing them?

Ciao and thanks again,

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113768
January 22, 2005 03:04 am UTC
January 22, 2005 03:04 am UTC
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,369
Regina, Sk
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Chris Clark Offline
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You could soak them in MCCC, but they wont come out as clean as mine.


1990 TSi AWD - Parked since I bought it (Jan24/03)
Had it out one day, and busted the trans.
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113769
January 22, 2005 03:34 am UTC
January 22, 2005 03:34 am UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Ottawa, ONT
What's MCCC? Can I do that without removing them? Is it imparative that I clean them, or what?

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113770
January 22, 2005 03:38 am UTC
January 22, 2005 03:38 am UTC

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Anonymous
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Dan, MCCC = Mopar Combustion Chamber Cleaner. It cleans out the carbon buildup. Go and grab a new tbelt, tensioner, headgasket and find a head for around 100-150 to toss on. Total repair should be under 300 if you source parts out correctly.

Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113771
January 22, 2005 03:44 am UTC
January 22, 2005 03:44 am UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Ottawa, ONT
Cool.

I actually got a block with a head on it that came out of a wrecked car that had only about 60000Kms on it for $100, have already gotten the tbelt as well as a full engine gasket set (FelPro) so I'm set!

This MCCC stuff; so you do leave the pistons in then? Is the procedure pretty straight forward?

Awesome! This is actually pretty fun, I'm enjoying playing mechanic! I just wish I had more time to do it, and could have it all done in a few days rather than months (at one day a week).

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113772
January 22, 2005 04:14 am UTC
January 22, 2005 04:14 am UTC
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 396
to, on
J
Jonathan Largon Offline
aka Michael Druciarek
Jonathan Largon  Offline
aka Michael Druciarek
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 396
to, on
pfft.. you guys got nothing on me!

http://www.trancetraffic.com/6bolt/DSC00345.html


6bolt, FP GT30R, 272/272 HKS, Forged Wiseco 9:1, Forged Eagle Rods, Metal HG, ARP Studs, Fidanza Flywheel, Tial 40mm, ACT 2600, 3" Turbo-Back, 850cc Injectors, Aeromotive FPR, Walbro 255, Huge FMIC, Greddy Type-S, Tein Adjustable Coilovers
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113773
January 22, 2005 04:17 am UTC
January 22, 2005 04:17 am UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Wow, that's pretty........but my goal's to simply get it running again! smile

Ciao,

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113774
February 04, 2005 08:59 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 08:59 pm UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Well crap,

So I've got it all put back together now, and it won't start. It did backfire twice, but no go.

Could this simply be a timing issue? Could it be something much more? Any takers?

Any Ottawa area guys eager to come to the rescue, and help me make it go?! smile

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113775
February 04, 2005 10:15 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 10:15 pm UTC
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,070
Ft.Erie ONT Canada
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Steve Leigh Offline
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Ft.Erie ONT Canada
Did you do a compression check first?


2007 Toyota Yaris RS

91 LASER RS (N/T) Auto (PARTING OUT)

95 Honda VLX
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113776
February 04, 2005 10:20 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 10:20 pm UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Well, that's yet another issue. I'm not sure that my compression tester is wokring correctly. It did cross my mind that that could be a problem, but I crossed my fingers that it wasn't! I've got a new head gasket installed, and the head and block are both cleaned and looked good. I'm getting so frustrated, it's been about 3 months of work, 1 day a week!

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113777
February 04, 2005 10:29 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 10:29 pm UTC
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 502
hanover
jay peterson Offline
Banned for Bad Debts
jay peterson  Offline
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hanover
sounds like timing , make sure you have the lines on the cam pullys lined up, also the dowel pins have to be facing up, go and check that, thats my guess. You lined up the marks but had the pins facing down.


Banned.
(below all bought, before paying debts to club members, thus reason for ban)
------------------------------
95 awd talon converted to 97 style eclipse GSX. ebach prokits, 60-1. 24x12x4intercooler, 2.5 ss intercooler piping. black safc.greddy660s,injen intake, apexi N1 3"titanium exhaust.greddy type s bov, 18"wheels. walbro 255,afpr,crower cams,. tial 38mil
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113778
February 04, 2005 10:34 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 10:34 pm UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
I'm pretty sure I got all the timing marks on all the gears and pulleys correct. I did have to remove the cam angle sensor off of the old head and install it onto this one. Could that affect iginition?

Also, I'm not 100% sure I have the ignition wires in the distributor (not the right word on my car a 1990 N/T 2.0L, what's it really called?) so that for sure could be it right?

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113779
February 04, 2005 11:07 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 11:07 pm UTC
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 15,322
Loc: Loc:
Rob Strelecki Offline

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Rob Strelecki  Offline

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Yes you will have to have the CAS oriented properly (it could be 180 degrees out of phase), and also the wires would have to be in the right order on the coil pack. 4-1-2-3 when looking at it from the driver side.


1993 Eagle Talon TSi FWD
13.8 @ 106 :::: 14.1 @ 117
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113780
February 04, 2005 11:18 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 11:18 pm UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Ottawa, ONT
Cool, okay......I'll double check those things then.

Which cylinder is considered #1? Driver's side? I'd need to know that as well to ensure that the plugs are going to the right cylinder.

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113781
February 04, 2005 11:20 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 11:20 pm UTC
Joined: Apr 2002
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Rob Strelecki Offline

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Loc: Loc:
#1 is always at the front of the engine.
That's the driver side on all 1G DSMs.


1993 Eagle Talon TSi FWD
13.8 @ 106 :::: 14.1 @ 117
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113782
February 04, 2005 11:23 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 11:23 pm UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Ottawa, ONT
Is it 1-2-3-4 from driver's to passenger or does it do anything crazy like 1-3-4-2?

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113783
February 04, 2005 11:39 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 11:39 pm UTC
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 15,322
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Rob Strelecki Offline

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Loc: Loc:
.........3
.........2 <-- coil pack
.........1
.........4
|4-3-2-1&#0124;&#0124;<-- timing belt
^-- engine


1993 Eagle Talon TSi FWD
13.8 @ 106 :::: 14.1 @ 117
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113784
February 04, 2005 11:42 pm UTC
February 04, 2005 11:42 pm UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Ottawa, ONT
Nice, good little schematic.

Thanks,

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113785
February 05, 2005 05:16 am UTC
February 05, 2005 05:16 am UTC
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,369
Regina, Sk
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Chris Clark Offline
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Regina, Sk
Spark/fuel/compression find out which one you are missing.


1990 TSi AWD - Parked since I bought it (Jan24/03)
Had it out one day, and busted the trans.
Re: Dented Pistons/Timing Belt/Engine Rebuild #113786
February 16, 2005 05:00 am UTC
February 16, 2005 05:00 am UTC
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Dan Webster Offline OP
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Dan Webster  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 43
Ottawa, ONT
Hey all,

I have no idea what's wrong with it, it seems to have spark (it backfires) and fuel's flowing. I've got no time to work on this damn car, I just wish it would RUN again! I'm so frustrated I've even listed it for sale but see now I'll likely never get what I'm hoping for it.

What would be the worst case scenario at this point? If there's no compression, would that mean the rings are foobarred, and I'd need to do a full engine rebuild. I have no time, or clue on how to do that very well.

I don't imagine there's anyone in the greater Ottawa area who just loves mucking around in these cars and would like to fix mine for peanuts and help out a poor starving student!? I dream.

Fark!

Dan


Carleton University Engineering
Computer Systems IV


http://ddwebster.com

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